Gloria Chow on PR, Visibility, and Why “Is It Enough?” Is the Real Question
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Gloria Chow on PR, Visibility, and Why “Is It Enough?” Is the Real Question
Host: Hello, and welcome back to From Trauma to CEO. Visibility at its best is not just about attention, it's not about strategy, it's about representation, voice, and the quiet permission it gives others to step forward. And while we often approach it through strategy and systems, there's always a human experience underneath it, one that involves identity, courage, and expansion.
Voiceover: Welcome to From Trauma to CEO, the psychology of transformational success with Faria Barlas. This is a space for cycle breakers, leaders, and visionaries who are ready to rewrite old patterns and rise into their fullest potential. Each episode explores the emotional, psychological, and identity-level shifts that turn lived experience into lasting, meaningful success. And now here is your host, Faria Barlas.
Faria Barlas: Today's conversation sits at that intersection because my guest, she has built her work around opening doors to visibility in a way that's very real, while also contributing to a much larger shift in who gets to walk through them. Gloria Chou is an award-winning PR strategist, community builder, and the host of the top-rated Small Business PR podcast. A former US diplomat turned small business advocate, Gloria has been featured on more than 100 podcasts, was named Pitch Writing Expert of the Year in 2021 by the Influential Businesswoman Award. Her unconventional, proven approach has helped small businesses across industries earn over a billion organic views and land features in outlets such as Forbes, Vogue, Oprah Daily, BuzzFeed, and Business Insider, all without pay-to-play. Named the number one small business PR strategist by ChatGPT and AI Search, she's leading the charge in helping overlooked founders dominate visibility, not just in the press, but in AI search results that drive discovery and trust. And I am proud to also be calling her my friend. Thank you so much, Gloria, for being here today, and I'm so excited for us to have this conversation. I've been looking forward to it for a while.
Gloria Chou: Oh, yes. Intro, my goodness, and it's so calm. Your voice is like so calming. I love it. You just like... I need you to like speak to me every morning, you know, get me in my zone.
Faria Barlas: I'll take that compliment any day. So, we met in person in this retreat, and we, I think one of the first conversations we had, literally as soon as we met, was about trauma. And I found it so refreshing, and I was pleasantly surprised at the level of the depth that you were bringing in to this conversation around trauma and your own kind of process and your own journey. Not to mention the very, very impressive work that you're doing. But what I do find very fascinating about your work is that on a surface, it's about PR, but underneath, really, it's about who gets to be seen, who gets to have a voice, and who gets to actually feel safe enough to take up that space. And you have been going through this process. You created something amazing. I wanted to kind of hear your perspective on that particular part around who gets to have this visibility because I know that you talk a lot about that gatekeeping. So, I'm very fascinated to hear your perspective and how you actually came to this, how did you think, "Okay, this is what I want to do." Cuz I know you had a different path before.
Gloria Chou: Yeah. I think if it's one thing I realize, if I were to talk about the arc of my story, which is obviously we all have our own unique arcs, I would say the thing that I thought was a like an inhibitor, which is that I was an outsider. So, I never worked a day in my life in any PR agency. I didn't, you know, rise up the ranks in an agency. I didn't have connections or a book of contacts. I had to cold call with shaking hands, like dialing the operator. And so I think at every juncture, I've always been an outsider. So even as a US diplomat, you know, like when you see me and five foot tall Chinese-American, you don't really think US diplomat. And then in terms of PR, 99.9% of all the PR coaches out there were former publicists or they have worked in the PR industry, and I haven't. So, being on the outside was really my disadvantage that I turned into my power because only from that creative space where I'm not playing by people's rulebooks, but I also don't have the framework, right, or resources, I'm able to create and innovate and truly disrupt. And I think when we look at PR, we think, "Oh, it's for politicians or celebrities." And this industry has made billions and billions of dollars doing good work, but it's not accessible for 99% of small businesses, right? If you think about a PR agency, what? They're $5,000 to $10,000 a month, every month, for at least a six-month contract, at least here in New York. And so for 99% of businesses, it's just not feasible. And so I think for small businesses, they just don't do PR, or they get into these traps of the pay-to-play, which is kind of a scammy ad that you're paying for. And so I thought, "Well, how can I not only be a visibility coach, but realize that this is one of advocacy?" And I think as I built my community, right, as an online coach, I didn't... I honestly didn't even set out to be a community builder, but people started coming to me. And it was really diverse people. It was a lot of first generation immigrants. It was people whose English is not their first language. We have people who are neurodivergent, who are cancer survivors, who have different physical abilities. And I realized, "Wow." Like, I think the reason why they gravitate towards me is because I'm also the first in doing PR this way. And so, your vibe attracts your tribe. And I'll never forget, I was at a retreat and this coach, who, you know, makes millions and millions of dollars, she has a really big platform, and we're talking about the subject of diversity. And she said something to me like, "You know, I really love diversity. I really want to champion diversity, but I just don't have a lot of diverse people in my course, in my program." And I I turned to her and I said, "You don't attract diversity, you become diversity." In the content that you consume, in the cultures that you get proximate to, in the life experiences that you get out of your way to actually experience, that's what it is. And people can subconsciously pick up on that. And so, I would say, out of anything, like, I'm really pride myself on having one of the most—the most diverse audiences, and I didn't really set out to do that, but I think it just kind of mirrors my own life experience, which has been very untraditional in many ways.
Faria Barlas: No, absolutely. And I think I was just thinking how you've actually... It's personal to you, you know, and I and it's so interesting because for a lot of us, what we do is personal, right? And you have managed to turn this thing, you know, the PR business, into something that is meaningful and personal. And I think that generally comes from somebody who has a lot of... Again, in my experience of working with a lot of high achievers, high performers, it comes from somebody who's done a lot of work and who is who is self-aware, who knows where I suppose their triggers are, who knows, you know, what they've gone through and the process to get to the other end. So, I think that's the reason why we immediately hit it off, and I was thinking, "Oh, gosh, yes, she she knows what we're what I'm talking about and she has firsthand experience of of that." I'm of— I'm curious, though, cuz I know that we I mentioned at the beginning that you were doing something else, you were a US diplomat. Can you tell me a little bit about that transition and not on the surface, but more as to what was going on internally for you as you Where did you get to that place of going, "Okay, I'm just going to pack it up," because, you know, it was a prestigious position? So and then you thought, "Okay, I'm just going to pack it up and then go into this unknown world of having my own business." And not just any business, PR business, which is all about visibility and helping others also be visible in a, as you mentioned, in a very untraditional way. Yeah. I'd love to hear about that.
Gloria Chou: It's funny because I feel like we all have certain gifts in this world, and we can express those gifts when we have the permission to in different ways. And I think I realized this later, but one of the things that people will always say about me is that I'm everyone's unofficial hype woman. I am like your cheerleader to the ends of the Earth. You talk to me and you feel confident. And so right now, I'm channeling it in a way of PR. But no matter what I do, no matter what happens in my life, that is my innate gift. We all have them. And, you know, but from a traditional path, you know, I was taught... I'm a I'm a daughter of a widowed immigrant, taught me to keep my head down and have a stable job because she grew up in Communism, and my, you know, my my uncles went to like actual labor camps. So, that level, like she didn't have running water or electricity in her house. So, that level of poverty was deeply ingrained in her and then passed down to me, which is safety, security, right? Which is so so common for so many immigrants. Of course. And so, I studied, you know, international relations. I've always loved things that were different, so I studied abroad in South Africa, you know, I really loved learning about different cultures. Um, you know, I I I went to like our local mosques and sat with the imam. Like, I always was really interested in getting to know different things. And so I thought, "Okay, great. International relations was for me because that's you get to travel." And then, when I quickly—what I quickly realized is that, yes, like the job is is great and you're doing things, but it's very bureaucratic. And so, you're not really allowed to color outside of the lines, you're not really innovating, right? You're kind of just following someone's playbooks. I think from a personality perspective, it just didn't align with me. And I realized that I was always meant to be an entrepreneur. I just didn't realize that until later. Like, I'm someone who learns by jumping in the fire, not by looking at a rulebook. Um, my husband, for example, will never be an entrepreneur. He likes to be in in a corporate world, right? So, I think it's just getting clear on what you want. And I realized that not only was the environment not conducive for me, I was a shell of myself. And it's funny because when you're not happy at work, you're also probably not attracting the best relationship either. So, I was also in a relationship that was very abusive emotionally, financially. And I just had to start over. And I applied for what, like a probably over a thousand jobs on LinkedIn, like have the receipts to show it, and I wanted to work in communications because I've always wanted to—I've always was strong in that. But nobody would hire me because they always wanted PR agency experience, and I didn't have that. And so, I just kind of had to start from the bottom, and I had to figure out, "Well, how can I still be in communications and do what I love to do, which is hype other people up and connect them, but again, I didn't come from a PR agency experience." So, basically, 99% of jobs was not available to me. And then I came across a friend who was like, "You know, you can start doing..." So, I first started doing consulting, right? So, I started working with a lot of tech bros. Literally, I kid you not, dialing the newsroom operator at Financial Times, at at at New York Times, Reuters, and just pitching to the operator until I got my client all the way up, you know, I got them prime time spots on CNBC, on New York Times. That was like hustling hard. And so, I was like, "Okay, I can turn this hustle into a repeatable thing." So, I started working with more fintech firms. And then I realized like I just don't love working with startup bros. I felt they were so entitled and I was just over it. And so, I was like, "How can I work with people who I really want, whose life experience is mimics mine?" And that's really women of color. And if you look at small businesses, who starts small businesses? It's women of color, mainly Black women, actually, that start small businesses more than anyone else. So, then it cre— then it became this advocacy work for me that's like, "Yes, I want to help you get featured, but how can we create safety around that?" Because if I give you... Like, I can't compete with the other, you know, PR coaches who, you know, maybe have like three decades in publicity, right? But I can create a safe space to make someone feel truly safe to be seen. Because I think it's not about like whether or not I'm seen, but like, "Do I feel safe? Do I feel okay taking up space?" That's really the internal work we have to do because I can give you all the contacts, but if you're not going to go after it because of some other subconscious thing, right? So, that's what I quickly realized like, "Wow, this is so much more than just putting a bunch of logos on your website. This is self-advocacy." Right? Like, especially for me, I was told to put your head down and not promote yourself, not talk about yourself. And maybe in your culture, too. But to be a business like owner, you have to keep shouting about your business to the ends of the world, right? And so everything I was taught growing up is really the opposite. But then, I became a hype woman for everyone else. And so I realized like, "I'm a first in many ways, but I also attract did other people who are okay to do PR in a different way." And so, we've been able to innovate and create accessibility for PR that's outside of the traditional model, which is all about paying someone who has a relationship, right? Cuz my people don't have access to relationships, they don't have privilege. And so, we've been able to create a third way, like a new model, and we've gotten thousands of small businesses featured, and it's really life-changing because then they feel like, "Oh, my god, like, my little Etsy store, it's like so much more than what I thought." Or, "You might be laughing at me because you think I'm doing something like—but then you get featured and you're like, 'Oh, my god, I'm the real deal.'" So, it really changes their entire frequency.
Faria Barlas: Oh, I—you know, it's so interesting because for me, this is what I see all the time around visibility. That, you know, you might be able to get rid of the friction on the outside, but what goes on inside is the thing that will either prevent you from... Because, you know, visibility is all about giving yourself permission to reveal yourself, really. And it's so um on point that you've were drawn, firstly, towards women and then, uh secondly, towards women who has who um historically have less or has had less opportunities to take up space. And I have a real theory about your success cuz I know you're doing amazingly well, and you are, uh by many people's standards, successful and very well-deserved, by the way. And I would say this is my theory: the reason why you've you've come to this success is because you have, uh whether intentionally or not, you've gone through the process of breaking your intergenerational trauma, right, around scarcity, around visibility, around taking up space. So, that kind of energy, that kind of expansion within you gives permission to others to actually see themselves through that lens. And I think that in itself is why this space around safety is created. And I think a lot of people can do PR work, and I know that lots of people are, but there is a specific type of projection and energy that you can give to people where they are able to maybe even dream or fantasize about something that they were never allowed to see, or something that their programming never gave them a template of what it looks like. So, with you having gone through that, having that awareness, and having, breaking, I'm sure lots and lots of different layers of that intergenerational trauma, and coming out the other end and now helping others, that is your superpower. And that is, in my opinion, that is the key, really, to your success. I I, you know, you mentioned uh this whole kind of environment that you grow up, you know, I I think it's fair to say, you know, and I just I actually just posted something earlier about the intergenerational trauma, so it's like very fresh in my mind around how historically, as women, we're not really we were not really, historically, allowed to take up space and to have this earning and everything else. And then add another uh dimension to it, which is collective, cultural, community, and all of that, we were we always have to go through many more obstacles, I believe, and mainly a lot of them internally, but some of them actually externally as well, as you've pointed out. I want to kind of hear a little bit about how you come to this understanding that, "Okay, in order for me to jump into this, everything that I want, and really leave behind my safety, security, and everything, I need to overcome, you know, a lot of these trauma patterns, if you like, or this programming that," you know, whether or not we like it, it gets passed on, you know, so this is what we this is the template we've got, the template is do the work, anything outside of this kind of square or whatever is going to be threatening. How did you deal with that? Because that's a big leap, that's a big step to take.
Gloria Chou: Yeah. Well, from a personal front, I think I don't think that I want to fault my our parents, right, for instilling that in us, because that they had literally nothing. Uh but then I realized that you have to check in with yourself what is your reality. And I live in a first world country, in a in a developed country, and so, for me, it was, "Well, if at what point does that narrative infringe on my freedom?" Because being able to be free is really my highest value in life. Like, I just if you like I just love freedom. Like, dance, it I like dance like no one cares, like I—it's I—it's I promote whatever a daily schedule that involves me waking up at 10:00 a.m. every day, like I don't care. Right? So, freedom is very important for me. So, Sure. at what point do you take off of that that armor or whatever, you know, the things that you've been carrying and no longer serve you? So, I I will say that at some point, it did serve me, right, because I was taught to really work hard and to have discipline and be hard on myself. But once you've reached that and you're still carrying that same narrative, it's time it's time to have a new operating system. I think where we go wrong is when we just have that operating system when we are born and then we carry that all the way through life. But we need to realize that there's different evolutions, there's different seasons, and so, how can we adapt it and stop the escalator and be like, "Where am I really going and am I really happy to be on this escalator?" I think a lot of people get very unhappy because they just get on the same escalator, they get to where they thought they were going, and they're like, "Well, I didn't really sign up for it," because they never really checked in with themselves.
Faria Barlas: You've actually described um my framework very, very beautifully because there is this So, in my framework, there is a trauma-led success and then we have reparative success. These are the two different kinds of success that we have. And actually, yes, you're absolutely right. So, trauma-led success is all the things that all the kind of tools and resources that gets us to where we are today, right? And then, at some—but it has a cap, it has a limit, and it doesn't what got us here is not going to necessarily take us to the next step. So, that's when we have to become aware that, hold on, this success and everything that we built, great, it served us and because trauma has its gifts, you know, that's what it is, trauma, especially if it's processed and we learn from it, trauma gives us the resilience. It gives us the that sensitivity around things. It gives us the ability to perhaps read the room before anybody else, depending on the kind of trauma and the kind of environment, right? So, it has its gifts and but then, at some point, you know, it's not going to take us any further because we're not in that threat or in that, you know, environment anymore. So, that's when we need to recognize that we need to change the pattern and reprogram completely, and then that's where reparative success comes along, which is you're the very perfect example of that reparative success. But then, you went through this process by yourself, so you And one of the things that one of the challenges that a lot of people have and face, and what I see a lot is that inability or, you know, of that lack of awareness this because they don't know any other way. So, this is how they got to success, this is how this is what's been working all this time, so now I'm going to continue with this because this is the only template of God. And my work has always been about encouraging people to question that, stop, pause, really understanding your patterns and programming, and taking steps, actual intentional steps, to change that. But you kind of went through this and you realized that hold on, this is not serving me anymore. I'm really curious about that process and what led you to go, you know, you didn't probably have the names and because I made up the names. It's my framework. But you this is exactly the path you followed. So, I want to know how did you go, "Okay, well, this is," you know, equivalent to that trauma-led success, "and I want that reparative success. I want that success that has freedom. It comes from a place of thriving. It doesn't it's expansive rather than me following a rigid programming." Just curious to know. And I know I'm asking this question because I have some information about not information, but we, you know, obviously, we've talked, and I know that you had to go through some processes and especially in relation to your relationship with your mother, which maybe many people would not link, "Oh, how is my relationship with my mother related to my business success?" But, of course, it is. So, I I'd love to hear your process on that a little bit.
Gloria Chou: Yeah. And it's and it's interesting, and I think what's important for your listeners is that the journey never stops, right? So, maybe I've broken one layer, but then I'm back at it again and something in my life makes me realize, "Oh, I need to further expand in this way." You know, obviously, when I left the government job with my pension, I realized it was just at the end of the day, I was young enough and I didn't have a family yet to support that it's like, "If not now, then when?" right? And I was so desperate to get out of the life that I had, the relationship that I had, that I just I had no other way, I just had to start over. And I had the means to do it because it wasn't like I was feeding kids at home. So, I was like thinking about all the pros and cons, and I just had to take a leap. It was not comfortable. I would have loved to get into another job before, but I think the universe made it so that it was impossible for me to get a job so that I could ultimately create my own business. Yeah. So, it was funny because I did—I finally did get a a PR job in New York, and it was a good offer. This was right around the time when I killed my ego and I realized like, other than just being awkward in like social settings of what do you do and I just say I walk my dog and people laugh cuz I didn't have a job then, other than that, it was like, "It's okay. It's not a big deal. It's just your own ego." And I did get a job. Um, I did get a job offer, and I actually decided not to pursue it. And this is a huge company that IPO'd, has billions of dollars, right? And, but I realized like, if I had gone down that path, it would have been a regression because the only thing that got me to that point was just self-trust. And so every day, I just had to trust myself even though I got rejection after rejection. So, it's like at any point, are you going towards self-trust and expansion or are you regressing? Right? And you always have to keep practicing that every day like a yoga practice or a, you know, maintaining a good diet. Never ends. And then, I finally built my business, and I and then I was chasing all the success, numbers, KPI, I was on all those bro marketing masterminds. And every, whatever, launch financial goal that I had, I achieved it, and then I had an utter like complete breakdown, right? I developed a fibroid the size of a baby's head in my uterus, 13 cm, that I had to remove. I had an open stomach in surgery. At that point, I never even broken a finger, so the thought of someone cutting into my uterus was like terrifying. So, they remove this. And when I saw that mass, and it was just this mass of cells, it was so weird and foreign, I was like, "Oh, this is what stuck energy is." Because it was literally in the sacral chakra, right, the one that controls money, belief, and and it was just I feel like it was such a symbolic thing. And I know a lot of women have fibroids, and we still don't really know where it comes from, but I think it's so interesting. So, I felt like that was the generational scarcity and trauma that my grandmother gave to my mom that she gave to me that I am working hard to take out in this lifetime. But I didn't learn my lesson just there then yet, because then I had bandages and staples, and four—was it three weeks later while still wearing bandages, I pulled off my first six-figure launch. And I went into a complete burnout because, of course, my body was screaming and I wouldn't—I was still chasing that number. And after I did that, I was like, "I'm not happy." You know, I did all the things that the online masterminds said, "This is the pinnacle of success of online business." And I was absolutely business absolutely not happy. I was not a good partner to my husband, I was not taking care of myself, I wasn't even washing my hair at that point, you know, so I had to just rewire what success looked for me. And I'm still doing that now because it's so easy to look outside for like, "This person's doing that." So, at every point, you just have to do those little micro habits, cuz every day, I get opportunity that's like, "Chase this shiny object or do this," and it looks great on paper, but then it's not in alignment with what I really want to do. And I think my highest value in life is not success, it's not excellence, it's freedom. And I want—and now, I travel three months out of the year. I just spent a month in Mexico, you know, working with my healer. So, that, to me, is the highest value in life, and so, how do I optimize around that? So, that has allowed me to orientate my schedule and the opportunities I say yes and no to, and just not growing all the time. And I also think we're in a great place in history where we realize that hockey stick growth of doubling every single year is not not only is it not natural, it's just not happening. And if we think about the natural world, what grows year after year after year? Cancer and viruses. Like, nothing in the natural world is meant to grow like that. Um, and so, I started to realize like, wow, I need to honor the seasons in my business.
Faria Barlas: And most importantly, honor your body and the messages that your body gives you because I think this is also becoming a, you know, I'm so glad we're having this conversation because a lot of the talk around, you know, how to have more success, how to expand, and all of that is focusing a lot on your cognitive processing, you know, your mindset, you know, your even, you know, even how nervous system regulation is being used is, you know, is very questionable at times for me because it's not integrated with other aspects of the work, which is, you know, all the trauma healing that you have to do, all the reprogramming, or the everything, all the everything together. And then people seem to just take one part of it and run with it. And, of course, it never touches the core because then the problem comes out in a different form. Initially, it's like exhaustion and, you know, maybe a bad relationship, but eventually, your bodies are going to respond. It's not going to because that's the only way to get your attention, to to say. And it sounds like you've listened.
Gloria Chou: I had to. I think the universe forced me in in many ways. And there's still so many people with like millions of followers, I think we all know who they are, that's like optimize, scale, portfolio, this is the amount of money I have. And I don't think that that's wrong. I think they've done something absolutely extraordinary. But I think with COVID and just us realizing that like everything is happening and we are here for a very short time, there's this collective awakening that's like, "Do I really want to just chase this?" Cuz like when you are on your deathbed, like, "Where are you going to take all that money? You going to put it in your grave?" You know? So like with your and I started to realize like there's so much richness in being present, in being able to like say, "No, I'm just don't feel like doing that today." Or, you know, creating spaciousness. So, defining richness in a different way for me has been absolutely powerful.
Faria Barlas: And, you know, what's funny is that as a result of that, the success will be a byproduct of that. It's not the other way around, right? So, actually, you know, when you are regulated, and I don't mean that in a way that's been used out there, but truly regulated, regulated around expansion, not just regulated, because there's a difference there as well. So, if you're regulated around the program around expansion and you are aware—I mean, we are never going to completely resolve all the traumas that we've gone through, but if you are at least have have that awareness, if you are working with that, if you are constantly questioning the identity that, you know, what identity have I taken on? Is it really aligned with who I truly am? All of that process, I—the outcome will only be success, and I've seen it so many times with my own clients, and I'll tell you what, it still surprises me every time I see it, even though I've been seeing this for the 23 years, I've I have gone through it myself, the whole process and come out the other end when kind of just when you let go of this idea and this programming around success and you focus on the things that are kind of running the show, the success is inevitable, right? It just happens and it comes in a way that is much more suited for who you are and where you are in life. And I think that's what you're experiencing as well, and of course, the process never ends, right? You know, it's something the awareness, the practice, the, you know, it and truth be told, that's one of the reasons why I'm so passionate about this work because you were you were one of the fewer people that whether you were forced to stop and question, you, you know, you had, you really trusted your intuition. Not everybody has that, you know, um privilege, I guess, to to be able to kind of connect to that. And I see that, I see that a lot, I see amazing people, very smart, very capable, hardworking, and they constantly keep themselves at that uh repetitive cycle of chasing something and then, eventually, sometimes even when they get it, as you mentioned, it comes as at a huge, huge cost. Totally. So, that's why this these kind of conversations are super important. And it's also just like amazing that it led you to do the work that you're doing and giving permission to others, not only to be visible, but to be visible in a way that's grounding and in a way that's safe. And that must be very rewarding.
Gloria Chou: Yeah. And I think you've touched upon something, which is there has been no better time in the history of sales and marketing to be yourself. And I think because we have AI, because everyone can be an expert, information is ubiquitous, people don't buy because you have a lot of followers anymore. You know that you can buy fake followers. And so, I think this whole like authority or expert is no longer moving people anymore. And so, instead of do you have the most expertise or are you the most authoritative? It's more is there any psychological resonance? Is there identity safety that's created? And it's funny because I used to follow everyone's templates, right? Marketing templates, sales templates, and we are at a point where every single person has seen all the templates. And so, we are we're subconsciously so discerning that those templates don't work as like they used to, which I think is a good thing, and it's really forcing us to feel like who am I really outside of all those templates and funnel bros, because again, it's not working anymore. And we're in this moment where it's like the people who come out on top are the people who are able to really have level of self-awareness and to not just be keeping up with the Joneses, as I like to say, you know, and so you're really be like, "I'm going to do something different."
Faria Barlas: Yeah, you could not have put it better, and you could not have said it better because that's exactly it. And that's what we are seeing that more and more, it's not the people just don't want on-the-surface stuff, people don't want templates, if they they want genuine connection, they want genuine compassion, even, right? So, you know, with with the work, like, you know, PR work has traditionally has been linked It it's not linked to let's say safety or like deep meaningful connection, right? It's more strategic. But you have you've created a completely different definition of that. And I know that you've you've done a lot of work around removing these external gatekeepers per se. But do you think that people do you see that as well, that people may still carry some of these internal gatekeeping, you know, like what are the what are the invisible rules, if you like, that some people still live by even though the obstacle might not be there because there you are trying to remove that obstacle and get that visibility more accessible. Do you think that people embodied that or do you think that there is a need for that kind of for that gap to meet?
Gloria Chou: Yeah. I think a lot of people look, "I can't compete with other PR coaches that have years and years of experience." But what I realize at its core, at least for my people, um who don't come from places where they naturally feel like they're a part of the main mainstream story. A lot of it is this feeling of, "Yes, I know my product is good, but is it enough? Is there enoughness? And how can we create a safe space to cultivate that enoughness at the core of the work that I do so that you feel like you have enough, whatever it is, website, followers, whatever, to be able to be featured in the media?" Because, you know, that's that's really the question that everyone's asking is, "I have 5,000 five-star reviews, but is it enough?" And there's never going to be a definition of when is it enough or not, it's very subjective.
Faria Barlas: And it's internal.
Gloria Chou: It's internal. Yeah, and that's a question they're always asking, "Is it enough to be featured, or is it enough?" Or, not should I, but is it enough. And so, as if I can spend my whole career answering that question, the better the more safety and the more clearly I can articulate that, I think the better my business is, cuz that's really what it's built around is at the end of the day, people think, "Is it enough? Is it enough?" Because they know they're transforming lives with their product, they know that people love their product, but they still question, "Is it enough?" And this is something that's very innately human within all of us is is it enough.
Faria Barlas: Yeah, is it enough? Am I enough? That's what really the question is, you know, underneath all of that, and that's the work that needs to be done, I think, before we I wouldn't say before we step into visibility, I just don't think that it has to be I don't want people to kind of completely jump into something that's dis— I mean, this is what I uh that's the work that I do, you know, not not disregulating your whole system, but actually taking kind of steps that are safe, and by that, you're you seem to be filling that gap, you know, and in the work that you're doing because it is that step to take where you are taking steps to be visible, you are breaking your cycle, your family cycle, and everything else, but then you're not you're still being held in that safe environment, and in the safety of somebody who's gone through it. I have one question, hopefully, the last one. [Laughter] I've got so many questions to ask you. This conversation could go on and on, so...
Gloria Chou: It could be like a 24-hour live streaming, I'm going to get some delivery, get some pizzas, popcorn, let's do it.
Faria Barlas: Yes, because there it you know, it's just, you know, it's just so fascinating with the, as I said, with the work that you're doing, but also the inner work that you've done. I want to know like, you— I know that me and you spoke about your your healing journey and some of the steps you've taken to, firstly, kind of heal the relationship with your mother, but also heal your relationship with yourself, success, forgiveness, and all of that. I'm— I like to hear a little bit about that, and also to hear how that change how that might have changed you, which I know it has [laughter] as a business owner and how you how you show up differently in your business.
Gloria Chou: Yeah. Ooh, that is a a thing, isn't it? Okay, so I... Okay, so my father passed away when I was three, and he was the entrepreneur in the family, actually. I actually take a lot after him, but he passed away when I was three, so my mother became a widow. And she always had to work, you know, and she provided for her siblings, so I grew up with aunts and uncles and grandparents, and I actually also lived with my best friend's family growing up in high school, it was a Black family. So, being at the intersection of all these things, extended family, be living with a Black family in white America, like, it was just so many different life experiences at once that it kind of made me into this like—I call it identity crisis on the inside. But I also only spent 8 years, 8 years of my life with my mom, like if I were to really count, right, because she was working and I was living with other people. And so, we had so much not just oceans and continents, but we had language, we had culture, we had belief systems, right? She grew up her first job was sewing shoes in a communist shoe factory, right, she didn't have a toilet in her house, she had to take communal showers, like that kind of poverty. But I was put in a very Western model of what my expectation of motherhood was because I grew up in Orange County, in California. So, my identity and my lens was very different, and so, we could never reconcile because I felt like I was always like, "Why didn't you call me?" and like all the things I expected a Western mom to do, she wasn't doing. But she was just, honestly, trying to survive. Yes. And so, there were so many years of resentment where I was like, "You didn't call me, you were not there for me, you don't want to know what's going on with my life," and just I think all that builds up to where we just had a very surface connection, and I was like, "This is a one relationship I just couldn't really reconcile." And then when I met my husband, who's comes from a beautiful family, they're I always say he's like a rare avocado, you know, that's not bruised. [Laughter] Two parents who are still living, who love each other, and love him, which is very rare for for a lot of people. And I realized how close he was with his family, and there was a lot of interesting problems because I was like, "Well, why..." I would make comments like, "Why why are you going to see your family in Italy all the time?" or why I didn't really understand the closeness because I never understood family. And so, through the lens of him being so close to my his family and triggering me and how unclose I was to my family, I started to examine well, where are the gaps and what am I missing out on? Right? And it was only through a psychedelic psychedelic plant medicine journey with a healer where I went through this beautiful somatic sound journey, but also with uh psychedelic-assisted therapy, I saw my mom like in the hospital holding my little hand and seeing my father's dead body. And in that moment, I was just like crying like from my bones, right, my husband was holding me. And I felt in that moment like just deep grief in my bones for a woman who never had the life that she wanted, whose love of her life passed away, who could never have the freedom to do what she want like I do because she was providing for everybody, whose daughter resented her for that, so I just felt so much grief in so many layers, and the moment I felt that grief, I just felt this flood of, sorry, I'm like spinning, uh flood of compassion overcome my body. And it was almost like this like I had to feel it because like, logically, I knew she had a hard life. But I had so much anger and resentment from all the years she wasn't there for me that there was no room to really feel anything different. And so through feeling and exploring the depth of her grief, was I able to open up a channel for true compassion. And I feel like a lot of things have to be felt in the body. I don't know if people disagree with me, but I feel like no like talk therapy could have helped me because I needed to feel that in my body. Mhm. And because the somatic therapy and psychedelic plant medicine has allowed me to feel that, everything changed. Now I fly her business class around the world, I took her to five countries last last year. And it's funny because you know, she had an autoimmune condition, so she was actually quite sick for a while. But now that I love her so much, I see her so much, I treat her like a queen, she feels like a different person, like she doesn't even take her medication anymore because she just feels so seen and supported for the first time ever from her daughter. And so I really, from that experience, realized like when you heal yourself, you heal everyone around you. Because she didn't change, she didn't do that journey with me, because I softened. I was no longer combative, and she still says things that triggers me, like we have a lot of disagreements about what happened in the past, right? She also got married, I had a stepfather, so it was very complicated. But I no longer react the way that I used to. I mean, we used to have shouting matches on the street, like where like she would get out of the taxi cab and like we would be kicked out of restaurants because we would just start shouting at each other, right? There was so much anger, and now, I've just softened a little bit. And so because I don't react to her in such a combative way, she softened. And it's just the ripple effects of all the things because it all—like it all set When people say, "The change starts with you," like I really felt like I lived that experience.
Faria Barlas: I actually saw some of the pictures of your last, you know, the trip that you had taken not long ago with your mother, and both of you look so happy and just it was amazing. It was so beautiful. And also, just to say, that yes, you're right, you know, because anybody that says, anybody that disagrees with the fact that somatic work, you know, trauma work, nervous system regulation as well as the cognitive work, if anybody claims that that's not needed, they don't understand the complexity of how we are organized and how human beings, and the way that we feel and think and operate in the world. So, and, you know, again, in my many 23 years of doing this work, I'm yet to come across somebody that gets that true deep healing that leads into expansion and growth without having the combination of this work. So, that's that's why I'm so glad that you've mentioned that because that's also a big part of the work that I do, you know, bringing out this understanding that, firstly, healing alone is not enough. It is the foundation, but it's not the destination. The destination is to have that, create that healing, so we can expand and grow because that that is our most kind of, natural, if you like, that that is our most That is the thing that makes us essentially happy or fulfilled in life, growth, and that's impossible without doing all the stuff, right? [Laughter] And it has to be integrated, it has to be linked to growth, it has to be linked to expansion. So, you know, I could, [laughter] you know, I couldn't agree with you more and you, I think, you are genuinely, as we are speaking more and more, you are a perfect example of this work and why this is so important and why therapy and healing and business coaching and, you know, all of them separately are not going to get you to the to the other end. It has to be a combination, and that's that's exactly what I do, and that is my work, and that is that's why I'm so passionate about it and also to get this message out that there's nothing wrong with you even if you've done the therapy work and it hasn't, you haven't gotten the result that you want, or if you've tried all these like other coaching strategies, it's not you. It's not that you're not meant to grow or succeed or anything like that. It is that the structure behind your growth needs to be completely updated. Gloria, I am so happy that we got to talk today, and I really enjoyed this, and I was holding myself back not to talk so much [laughter] because I constantly wanted to step in and just um ask more questions and, but it's been a real pleasure speaking with you. Thank you so much for being open and honest and just telling us exactly how it is. It's very rare and I am very grateful for that.
Gloria Chou: Me, too. I'm grateful that you created a space for this conversation, so it takes one to know one. I always say, "Your vibe attracts your tribe." So, that's why we're here.
Faria Barlas: Exactly. Thank you so much, and that's it for today. I will catch you guys in the next episode.
Voiceover: Thank you for listening to From Trauma to CEO, the psychology of transformational success with Faria Barlas. Check out the show notes for more information on how to continue this work or explore more of Faria's teachings. If this episode resonated, please follow, review, and share it with someone who needs this message, and we'll see you in the next episode.
Episode Summary
Visibility is often treated as a marketing strategy, but what if the biggest obstacle isn't getting noticed, but feeling safe enough to be seen? In this episode, Farya Barlas is joined by award-winning PR strategist Gloria Chou to explore the connection between visibility, identity, trauma, and self-advocacy. Together, they discuss how healing inherited patterns, redefining success, and creating psychological safety can help entrepreneurs step into leadership, build authentic businesses, and create meaningful impact.
What You'll Learn
Why visibility is about more than marketing and PR, and how feeling safe to be seen influences business growth and leadership.
How childhood experiences, intergenerational trauma, and cultural conditioning shape your relationship with success, self-promotion, and taking up space.
Why healing your internal beliefs around worthiness and enoughness is just as important as learning business strategies.
How redefining success around freedom, alignment, and well-being creates more sustainable growth than constantly chasing external achievements.
Why authentic visibility and genuine human connection are becoming more valuable than traditional marketing templates in today's AI-driven world.
Free Resources
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Find out if your success is trauma-led or reparative using this FREE short diagnostic checklist to uncover whether your drive/success is coming from pressure, survival patterns, so you can have a clear next step toward reparative, grounded growth.
Check out her Website faryabarlas.com for resources and programs.
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